A Daf A Day (daf yomi)

A daf yomi blog for discussion, questions and comments on the daily daf.

Tuesday, March 15, 2005

Reb Yosi in the Mishnah

The Mishnah on 15a mentions that according to Reb Yosi if you read Shema and cant hear the words you are not yotzei. It also mentions that according to Reb Yosi if you read the words but are not careful pronouncing the words properly you are yotzei. It seems to be a contradiction in the opinion of Reb Yosi? It would seem that his opionions should follow along the same lines, namely if you dont do the Shema properly you are either yotzei or not? You can of course say that the first case in the Mishnah is based on a limud from pesukim. However, why cant you make the following argument: If a person reads the words but does not pronounce them properly it is no different than not hearing them at all. Either way you are not hearing what is supposed to be heard. Reb Yosi should hold then in the second case that you are not yotzei. Basically, how do we differentiate the cases according to Reb Yosi? I did not have time to look for an answer assuming the question is even valid! Please help.

1 Comments:

At 5:52 PM, Blogger joshwaxman said...

"If a person reads the words but does not pronounce them properly it is no different than not hearing them at all."

Why make that assumption. Not reading properly seems to be specifically as Rav Ovadia cited a brayta to Rava, that of running words together. In such an instance (Al-levavecha with no pause between the lameds) you can still understand all of the words. So all of the words have been said, just some pauses were missing. And you understand what you are saying. So why would you think one would exclude the other.

Further, Rabbi Yossi is also of the opinion that you can say it in any language that you understand. If you understand your garbled speech and it comes to your ears, perhaps Rabbi Yossi would consider it a valid Shema in that "language."

The derashot is the true answer, though, I think. There are separate parameters of volume, language, and clarity, and the insistence or non-insistence on each of these are each hinge upon derivation from psukim. Once you come up with a combination of derivations that define the halacha, you might then figure out the philosophy of why X and not Y, as you are trying to do. The best proof that they do not in fact consider these (pronunciation, volume) the same is that separate drashot are required for each.

 

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